An in depth study of Pam and Barbara (Secret 7)

[pete9012S]

Yes an in depth study of these often misunderstood and overlooked characters.

It's not all Captain Peter in The Secret Seven - somebody must receive and act out on his orders, which must be obeyed..

What was their background?

How did they come to join the Secret Seven?

Did they have any siblings that were denied entry into the club?

What outstanding contributions did they bring to the adventures?

Did they make any major gaffs worth mentioning?

Did they ever leave/or get booted out of the Secret Seven?

How did they differ in personal appearance?

Did they ever forget the password?



Pam & Barbara in full Rottweiler mode as they eject the ubiquitous interloper (and my dream babe) Susie from the environs of the sacred shed..

[pete9012S]

Pam & Barb's first ever uttered lines in book one, enjoy!

There was another knock at the door. It was Pam and Barbara. There was silence in the shed.
Everyone was listening for the password.
" Wenceslas," hissed Barbara, in such a peculiar voice that everyone jumped.
" Wenceslas," whispered Pam. The door opened, and in they went.
" Good—you're both wearing your badges," said Peter, pleased. " Now where are Colin and
Jack ? They're late."

Pam gets 31 mentions in this book and Barbara 25, so that's nice.

[GloomyGraham]

Can't remember the boom but I have a vague memory of Pam and Barbara having to team up to look for clues and they kind of gave up (were they at a bus stop?). But I think Janet got praised for her work that day.

Of course, like Janet, they always got left behind when the boys went out adventuring after dark.

[Barnard]

I do wish that the Secret Seven were given surnames.

[pete9012S]

Many thanks for those posts GG & B.

The Barbara & Pam team up at the bus stop - I will try and find that -cheers.

What a great surname point Barnard, thank you.

On a slightly tenuously connected surname note, it was Pam (and George) who found out that the distinctively named Mr. Holikoff, 64, Heycom Street, Covelty owned the old house in book one, Secret Seven..

[TheAngryPixie]

Peter could really have trimmed the Secret Seven down to Four and achieved the same--Himself, Janet, Jack and maybe George.

If he insisted on there being more, then he could make Scamper an official member and give Susie an invite. The Secret Six.

But then, I suppose he does need someone to do the grunt work. Much like Fatty and Bets needed Pip to make the teas and sweep up after them and carry some boxes of disguises around or whatever.



I always imagined Pam & Barbara were Janet's friends, and Jack, Colin and George, Peters. I forget--are Peter and Janet the same age? I always imagined Peter to be older.

[Barnard]

I always thought that the boys were one year older than the girls.

[pete9012S]

More character analysis on Pam & Barb from Keith's site:

Pam is the 'silliest' member of the group. She constantly leads Barbara into fits of giggles during meetings and important parts of the story. Pam always annoyed me a little, just because she was always goofing off and shirking her responsibilities.

For instance, in Go Ahead Secret Seven she and Barbara are given a task (observing people and writing down what they remember), and come back with a report that doesn't make sense because they continually giggled and didn't concentrate.

She's also by far the noisiest of the Seven and scarcely a meeting goes by without some type of outburst or silly suggestion from Pam. She does occasionally redeem herself though—and once or twice you give a sigh and realise she does actually belong with the rest of the Seven.

Barbara is Pam's "shadow". She follows Pam around constantly, and there's no use pairing her with somebody else to do any investigation—the two girls seem inseparable! I think Barbara would be a lot better if she was removed from Pam for a while, but we never really get the chance to see her alone.

She does come out with some very silly suggestions and comments during discussion, which make her appear to be a little 'barbie-doll'-ish. I always picture her as blonde, and I think many of the illustrations have this depiction too.

https://www.enidblyton.net/secret-seven ... cters.html

[pete9012S]

More observations on these two by Hari Menon:

Pam: One of the two gigglers in the club. Perhaps her sole contribution to the club is when she "interviews" her grandmother in Three Cheers Secret Seven (and misspells the word "absolutely" in the process). She's a great friend of Barbara, for obvious reasons. Either of them is sportingly ready for a good cry when Peter starts shouting—at them or one of the others, it doesn't matter.

Barbara: Giggles, squeals and shrieks come naturally to Barbara, as they do to Pam. Indeed, you can't easily tell one from the other. Perhaps that's why Derek Lucas' illustrations show Pam in pigtails, while Barbara leaves her hair free. I used to consider her very pretty in those illustrations when I was ten years old. Ah, the follies of youth.

https://www.enidblyton.net/secret-seven ... seven.html

[Anita Bensoussane]

The first word that comes to mind when I think of Pam and Barbara is "gigglers" so I'm not surprised that both Keith and Hari mention their giggling!

I always imagined Pam & Barbara were Janet's friends, and Jack, Colin and George, Peters.

The boys and girls go to separate schools so that may well have been the case to begin with, but they've obviously played together outside school as they all know each other. In Secret of the Old Mill Peter and Janet discuss which of their friends they'll have in their society. Peter picks Barbara because he considers her "good fun":

"We'll talk in a low voice, because it's very, very secret," said Peter. "Now - who shall we have for our band, our Secret Society, Janet? Only boys and girls we really like and trust. We mustn't have anyone who will give the password away."

"I should have Colin - and Jack - and Pam - and George," said Janet. "We both like them - and we know they can keep a secret, because we've tried them before. Let's get them all here on Saturday and have our first Secret Society meeting!"

"Yes - and choose the password, and plan what we are going to do!" said Peter. "It will be fun! Let's have Barbara, too. I like her - she's good fun."

I always thought that the boys were one year older than the girls.

I've always thought that too.

[TheAngryPixie]

The first word that comes to mind when I think of Pam and Barbara is "gigglers" so I'm not surprised that both Keith and Hari mention their giggling!

I always imagined Pam & Barbara were Janet's friends, and Jack, Colin and George, Peters.

The boys and girls go to separate schools so that may well have been the case to begin with, but they've obviously played together outside school as they all know each other. In Secret of the Old Mill Peter and Janet discuss which of their friends they'll have in their society. Peter picks Barbara because he considers her "good fun":

I never knew there was another Secret Seven book. Interesting. I have never read it.

That to rest my theory that each invited their own friends from school. Though it's odd that Barbara is initially left out by Janet. Maybe she is new to the area so they don't know her as well.

I still think they should have added Susie.

[Bertie]

I still think they should have added Susie.

I guess this is more of a debate for the Susie thread, but I really don't agree about that.

Susie is the protagonist. A dislikeable figure similar to Goon in FFO, and obnoxious kids like Edgar and Junior in FF.

There seems to be a defence for her that she only acts as she does because they won't let her join - I'd say the opposite is true, they don't want her to join, or want her as a friend, because of the way she acts, and would likely continue to act as a member. She's very likely to continue being very self serving and not a good team player as the others are.

Just look at how her own attempts at forming a group end up. There's a reason why she's completely unable to achieve what the others have with the SS, despite the unproven suggestions that she'd be every bit as good, or even better, a leader than Peter.

Her character is fine for exactly what she is in the books - a selfish protagonist there to unsuccessfully compete against the 'good' group of children.

[Bertie]

Pam and Barbara seem likeable, albeit frivolous and largely unimportant members of the group.

You can see why the others like them, and why they're a part of the group. But if you were going to take any out and not really notice a huge difference, then Pam and Barbara would be right up there as the likeliest options.

But I'm glad they're in the books as they're likeable characters, and not every one has to be either a genius, dependable or fiery. So they've a good mix in the group.

They remind me of early Bets (before Enid makes her Watson to Fatty's Holmes), or either Nora or Peggy from Secret Island (the one that's less dependable).

[pete9012S]

Many thanks to all for all the latest posts - all most enjoyable.



Pam (and George) in action in the first book - top George Brook - bottom Derek Lucas.


1991 Award, illustrations and cover by W.F.P.

P.S.
Has anyone seen/got an opinion on the illustrations by' W.F.P.' from 1991 - I don't think I've seen them??

[Lenoir]

In "Go Ahead Secret Seven" it does say that all the girls, including Susie, are in the same class at school.
Barbara is quieter than Pam. She sticks up for Pam when Peter loses his temper and they seem to be best friends as they always go around together.