Who is Enid's worst villain?

[Nick]

Mr Rolland from Five Go Adventuring Again is a villain that I find most somewhat unsettling. His manipulation of the children and Uncle Quintin Is chilling and there is one line that gives me the shivers. It is when the children, minus George, are searching for the Secret Way, the artists are present and Rolland appears. Anne immediately runs to him and “slips her hand” into his. Rollands grooming of Anne makes me feel very, very uneasy.

[Anita Bensoussane]

Just for the record ...... who are 'Mr. Marvel' and 'Bruno Vincent?
Is the former connected with one of the circus books?

Mr. Marvel is from The Rubadub Mystery as I mentioned earlier. Bruno Vincent has written modern Famous Five parodies aimed at an adult audience (Five Go Gluten Free, etc.) but they're weak and weary and not very funny in my opinion.

[dsr]

Mr Rolland from Five Go Adventuring Again is a villain that I find most somewhat unsettling. His manipulation of the children and Uncle Quintin Is chilling and there is one line that gives me the shivers. It is when the children, minus George, are searching for the Secret Way, the artists are present and Rolland appears. Anne immediately runs to him and “slips her hand” into his. Rollands grooming of Anne makes me feel very, very uneasy.

That's not grooming. That's just that the book was written in a time when "a stranger is a friend you have not yet met" not "stranger danger".

I have a diary written by by mother of a holiday in 1972 when my sister (aged 6) on a group ramble would hold hands with most of the old people in turn. In those days it was possible to like children and still be thought of as normal.

[Debbie]

As for actual Blytonian villains, I'd definitely pick Mr Marvel and Jo-Jo as among the worst, as others have suggested. The climax of The Island of Adventure, when I first read it a few years ago, just about chilled me to the core — I don't think I'd ever read another Enid Blyton book where the chief villain was prepared to actually kill the children while making his own escape. That would have terrified me if I'd read it as a child!!

I think the villains in Sea of Adventure are far more scary than Jo-Jo. You definitely feel that if they catch up with them then they all will be killed, probably shot as soon as Bill has (or hasn't) told what they want to know. Yes, Jo-Jo was trying to kill them but he wasn't planning on doing it himself-letting the water do it. However you don't really meet the villains in Sea so they can't really count.
The Adventure villains do stand above the other stories as you do feel they are ruthless. However I think the manipulation in other stories does mean they can be worse-they're deliberately using the nice natures of the good guys to further their ends.

But yes, I think I'd agree with Mr Roland. He does groom the children, especially Anne, to be against George, we assume with the idea that she can be punished by having Timmy out of the house. Although, actually, was it necessary? He was in the house, and probably could have worked out a way of doing it without looking suspicious.
Maybe it was simply that George was rude and he didn't like her.

[tix]

Anita Bensoussane - thank you for the info; I hadn't seen this thread's initial entries.

Despite the Barney collection's popularity I've never liked them all that much. Having read the series once or maybe twice - ages ago, I can remember an element of 1950's 'pop-culture' being introduced at one stage when Snubby strums on a racquet (I think) - endeavouring to imitate a rock performer.

Tended to be a little modern for my conception at the time of our author's basic style.

Haven't yet read any of the Blyton imitations but they appear quite popular. We can't seem to get enough original tales, so more have had to be created in one way or another.

[Wayne Pyer]

Jo Jo for me. The way his eyes rolled back in his head as he lost control. Terrifying.

[Stephen]

As for actual Blytonian villains, I'd definitely pick Mr Marvel and Jo-Jo as among the worst, as others have suggested. The climax of The Island of Adventure, when I first read it a few years ago, just about chilled me to the core — I don't think I'd ever read another Enid Blyton book where the chief villain was prepared to actually kill the children while making his own escape. That would have terrified me if I'd read it as a child!!

I think the villains in Sea of Adventure are far more scary than Jo-Jo. You definitely feel that if they catch up with them then they all will be killed, probably shot as soon as Bill has (or hasn't) told what they want to know. Yes, Jo-Jo was trying to kill them but he wasn't planning on doing it himself-letting the water do it. However you don't really meet the villains in Sea so they can't really count.
The Adventure villains do stand above the other stories as you do feel they are ruthless. However I think the manipulation in other stories does mean they can be worse-they're deliberately using the nice natures of the good guys to further their ends.

Yes, I always thought that the largely unseen villains in Sea are merciless and terrifying. And if you think about it, they technically do shoot and injure one of the regulars! Are there any other moments in a Blyton in which a character is hit by a bullet?

The flooding of the mines in Island has to be perhaps the most dramatic moment in an Enid Blyton book. But I suppose in causing this to happen and walking away without bothering to watch, Jo-Jo comes across as more of a Batman villain!

[Katharine]

The flooding of the mines in Island has to be perhaps the most dramatic moment in an Enid Blyton book.

When I read this book as a child, I don't think I particularly formed a view of it one way or another. However re-reading it a few years back I found it really chilling.

[Irene Malory Towers]

Not adding anything new here, but I agree with all - Lou and Tiger Dan were particularly evil, as was Mr Marvel and the unseen Sea of Adventure villains and of course Jo Jo. Also I found Red Towers in the Famous Five particularly unpleasant. He threatened to kill them and nearly did kill Timothy, Even his "colleague" if you can call him that did not like him. But don't forget the Nazis in the Adventurous Four and also in Smuggler Ben and the Children of Kidillen.

[Darrell71]

Sea of Adventure is one of my favorite books, and I agree that they're probably the most well-connected and dangerous villains. However, I also personally hate Mr.Roland more, especially since he fools our protagonists (well, some of them, anyway) almost until the end! That is quite unusual in Blyton books, is it not?

[Anita Bensoussane]

I agree that the villains in The Sea of Adventure are all the more menacing for being faceless and nameless.

[MJE]

Thank you Daisy - And John for not mentioning BM too!!!

     Who's B.M.? (I have a funny feeling the answer will be something I will find so obvious once I know that I will kick myself for being so stupid.)

[MJE]

Mr Rolland from Five Go Adventuring Again is a villain that I find most somewhat unsettling. His manipulation of the children and Uncle Quintin Is chilling

     And of course, because we read that Timmy turned his back on Mr. Roland and refused to shake paws/hands with him when first meeting, we *know* Mr. Roland must be a no-good character. Timmy seems a better judge of character than most humans in the books.

and there is one line that gives me the shivers. It is when the children, minus George, are searching for the Secret Way, the artists are present and Rolland appears. Anne immediately runs to him and “slips her hand” into his. Rollands grooming of Anne makes me feel very, very uneasy.

     But I wonder if you may be reading a bit too much into this. Of course, in this era when paedophiles, if not more numerous today, are at least given more prominence in the media, and feared much more, we may read sinister meaning in Mr. Roland "grooming" Anne in this way than anyone would have at the time the book was written and is presumably set in.
     To be sure, Mr. Roland is being insincere in comforting Anne, which I presume he must have done if Anne ran to her this way (I don't quite remember the detail of that scene): he is after all a criminal and enemy posing as a friend and someone to be trusted, and his comforting of Anne could be seen as part of that facade he is presenting. But I honestly don't see anything about this any more sinister than that, than ordinary deception - and certainly nothing even faintly paedophilic in character.

Regards, Michael.

[MJE]

That's not grooming. That's just that the book was written in a time when "a stranger is a friend you have not yet met" not "stranger danger".

I have a diary written by by mother of a holiday in 1972 when my sister (aged 6) on a group ramble would hold hands with most of the old people in turn. In those days it was possible to like children and still be thought of as normal.

     That is true, when you really think about it. In many public situations, where an adult and child do not already know each other, it is taboo for an adult to pay any attention to a child - adults and children are effectively segregated socially in modern society. What a sad commentary on the way society has become!
     If I were in a situation, like a tour or something, where a group of various ages was present and interacting, I would just keep well away from any children, even if they seemed to want to approach me, lest I be accused by some paranoid, possessive, tigerish mother of attempting to groom the child.
     Even just the accusation could destroy your reputation and maybe career. Just not worth the risk! No wonder male teachers are apparently giving up primary school teaching now - it is a dangerous job! I don't blame them, even though the shortage of male teachers has been regarded as detrimental to the education of children.

Regards, Michael.

[Anita Bensoussane]

Thank you Daisy - And John for not mentioning BM too!!!

     Who's B.M.? (I have a funny feeling the answer will be something I will find so obvious once I know that I will kick myself for being so stupid.)

I can't work it out either. Put us out of our misery, Pete!