The Secret Series

[Daisy]

Nigel's quotes seem to reproduce a smiley - seems a bit odd your software does not permit that Michael.

Of course the biggest discriminatory label used today is that of gender. How many times have people said 'woman driver' or 'men can't mult-task' etc. etc.?

Yes, we still hear tales of a "woman police officer" on the news, or a "male nurse".

[sixret]

Bullying happens not only to the children but also to adults in many situations and environments. The worst thing in bullying is when others just do nothing to help the victim as if it is not their problem. The reasons are usually varied like the victim is not 'one of them', the person who bully has a dominant characteristic, seniority in the workplace/neighbourhood to name a few.

Sixret, fortunately it didn't happen to me in school as I was rather popular in my class and also never scared away from a fight if I noticed that another class mate was bullied. Since then I hate unfairness.
I can realte to Robert's story as my grandmother sewed my dresses (I hated them!) and I also had to wear glasses, so some of my class mates (this was an all girls high school) did make certain remarks once in a while, but as I never shyed away from defending myself, they stopped after a few incidents.

BUT I had a very mean program manager once who took every chance she got to bully me.
However, I got my revenge after a year.
I finally had enough (depression, stomach ulcer and ultimately breast cancer), quit and applied for unemployment insurance. As you are usually not getting any unemployment benefits in the US when you quit a job yourself, I had to go to the unemployment court.
The unemployment/Work Force judge listened to my story and also listened to the untrue claims that this person invented against me, but I had kept all daily work print outs like call sheets (which listed the amount of calls I had done per day) and could make her look bad, because my daily call average was above the limit that was expected from us.
And in the end I even overcame my fear of her and realized what a miserable, low life person she actually was.
To make a long story short, the judge decided in my favor, the company ended up paying me almost as much in unemployment benefits as my former net income used to be, this was for a total of 99 weeks .

I missed your comment. Good for you, Chrissie. I agree, we must fight for our right.

[MJE]

Nigel's quotes seem to reproduce a smiley - seems a bit odd your software does not permit that Michael.

Of course the biggest discriminatory label used today is that of gender. How many times have people said 'woman driver' or 'men can't mult-task' etc. etc.? :wink:

Yes, we still hear tales of a "woman police officer" on the news, or a "male nurse".

     When I said "software", I was speaking very loosely to just refer to "something somewhere in the system", because the fact that this happens when I quote posts in two totally different operating systems and sets of software seems to make it unlikely that it's due to any specific software I do. If the same thing doesn't happen with others, like you for instance, Daisy, then maybe it isn't the forum itself either, as I suggested earlier.
     Bottom line, I suppose, is that I have no idea what causes it, and can't even think of hypothetical possibilities - but clearly it does happen, nonetheless.

[A minute or two later:]
     Look - it's just happened again now: I previewed this post before posting it, and I can see what's happened in the quote above, which includes one of Katharine's smileys. If I actually tried to put a smiley in my own writing (which I've never done), I wonder whether it would happen there too.
     I don't think I'm ever going to start now, since it just doesn't come naturally to me, and would seem artificial; but - strictly for the sake of scientific research - let me try putting in one or two now, and see what happens:

  Punctuation style smiley: :-)
  Graphic one selected from list at the side: :D
    (I selected one and it appears in the edit window in punctuation style anyway.)

     Okay - I will post this now and see what appears.

Regards, Michael.

[MJE]

     Nope - they just remain as punctuation - not even changed to a word like "grin" or "frown", etc., as I've observed sometimes when I quote others' smileys.
     Well... who knows? I'm slightly curious, but am not going to lose a lot of sleep over it.

Regards, Michael.

[Tony Summerfield]

There is no great mystery here, Michael, I have just been into your profile in admin and in your preferences you have got the smilies disabled. They are automatically there by default when somebody first registers, but if a person wishes to disable them they can and you have done so.

[Katharine]

Well I'm not impressed with Spiggy Holes so far.


SPOILER ALERT SPOILER ALERT

The children have just let themselves into the empty house next door and been caught by the new owners. I'm quite shocked at Enid's attitude that the children have done nothing wrong, and yet they basically forced an entry into the property, and even Dimmy didn't seem particularly bothered by what they'd done. Just told them they'd better not go there again, rather than giving them the scolding they deserved. Also interesting to note that Enid seemed to think it perfectly ok to eat the fruit from the garden as no one was living there so it would just go to waste, and yet I seem to recall that she dismissed her own gardener for doing the same!

Then there's the children's disbelief that anyone could have spoken to them in such a manner and were frightened that the owners threat of punishment might really be carried out. Errrrrr, are their memories so bad that they've forgotten the treatment they were given by their aunt and uncle only the year before????? So far a very poor book, and there's not even the excuse that Enid's mind was failing.

[Carlotta King]

I always assumed that the children were shocked because the people who shouted at them were strangers. We're all used to our parents or guardians telling us off, so you wouldn't bat an eyelid at that, but for a stranger to yell at you and threaten you, that's very frightening.

I remember when I was a girl, I was out walking down the road with my best friend, we were about 11 or 12 at the time. There was a young woman standing on the pavement, she was probably in her early 20s but to us she seemed incredibly grown up and sophisticated, and she had her hair done up in a big fancy style, and she was wearing nice clothes and had a lovely bright handbag. My friend and I, at age 12, were just starting to get interested in make up and clothes, so I was staring at this woman in awe, thinking how lovely she looked and how I wished I was grown up like her. Well she obviously didn't like being stared at because she snapped at me "What are you looking at? Have I got green spots on my face?!" and I was absolutely terrified and shocked and hurried off sharpish!!
So being yelled at by strangers can be rather scary, whereas if your parents or relatives tell you off then that's just normal because they've got every right to tell you off and you just accept it.

So I guess I can understand why the children were perhaps a bit frightened, maybe?

[Irene Malory Towers]

Having just read the secret series - several editions even - I thought I should read through this whole thread of discussion, and very interesting it was - with lots of other subjects from political correctness to other children's authors being out of print and modern covers of the secret series being raised. Back to the Secret Series, however, I am surprised that the Secret of Spiggy Holes was so unpopular as it was my favourite, not sure why really. Moon Castle was the weakest and most people agree. The Mountain and Killimooin were very strong exciting adventures - but both incredibly unlikely. I have made this suggestion in another post as to why the Secret Series were not as popular as other EB series. I think it is because although the adventures are exciting the characters are not so developed as in her other series. Prince Paul is a tad annoying, and Jack loses his individuality and his leadership skills after Spiggy Holes and there is nothing to distinguish the girls after the Island book. I like the Secret Series but the FFO, Famous Five, Barney series and Adventure Series are far stronger because of the characters.

[Anita Bensoussane]

I take your point about the characters in the Secret books not having as much individuality (after the first title), Irene, but I find the series strong anyway because it's so varied and never becomes formulaic. That means the stories are unpredictable and quite quirky - aspects which I've always enjoyed enormously. And the characters come across as a tight-knit, supportive and very likeable team, drawing us into their world.

[Debbie]

I would say Jack keeps his leadership skills throughout, and Peggy keeps her motherly looking after skills.
Mike tends to become a side kick and not much else though, which is a pity, but Nora loses her slightly whingy side (unusual for an EB "nice" character to have that side) which is definitely a good thing. I always forget Mike and Nora are twins because he seems far older than her.

As an aside I was reading Noel Streatfield's "House in Cornwall" and the plot reminded me a bit of Spiggy Holes. It made me think though about how different EB's characters are across books. NS you get the pretty, clever oldest, the difficult middle child with no obvious talents and the supremely talented youngest with sometimes other children added round them and you could interchange them around.
EB you wouldn't confuse Julian with Jack or Barney or Philip (or Jack Mannering) or Fatty. Dick isn't the same character as either Pip, Larry, Mike, Roger etc. George is very much one of her own, and although Anne has something in common with Lucy Ann or Peggy, they're quite distinct, and nothing like Daisy or Bets...

[Wolfgang]

I didn't like the Secret series much as a child - I read the German editions. The secret Island was okay, but far from being out-standing. When I finally started to read the English editions I had to learn that the German editions were heavily edited, altered and butchered, but the adverb lovingly doesn't come into mind seeing the result. I see absolutely no reason making Peggy the youngest one of the children.

[Irene Malory Towers]

You have a good point Debbie re Jack and his leadership skills and Peggy re her motherly attributes but nevertheless after Spiggy Holes I feel that these individual characteristics have faded into the background. But nevertheless they are a good series, but for me I prefer the other adventure type series and I was trying to think why that is so. Perhaps it is just individual preference. I am glad that I procured the Secret of the Mountain as I really enjoyed that, plus bought the older versions of the Secret island and the Secret of Killimooin as the earlier illustrations really enhance the stories. I am afraid I can't be bothered with Moon Castle as even at the time like so many last books of EB series I thought it was much weaker than the rest.

[Hannah]

I didn't like the Secret series much as a child - I read the German editions. The secret Island was okay, but far from being out-standing. When I finally started to read the English editions I had to learn that the German editions were heavily edited, altered and butchered, but the adverb lovingly doesn't come into mind seeing the result. I see absolutely no reason making Peggy the youngest one of the children.

I've wondered if the German editors couldn't live with a girl as the oldest of the siblings (which in most other books meant a leading role) - even though she isn't the leader in the English books.
The changes are really annoying.

[Lucky Star]

I would agree that Jack keeps his leadership qualities throughout the series. Other than that the others do indeed fade in to the background a little as the series goes on. But then it's not a very long series so this doesn't become too much of a problem. Prince Paul is annoying but I can recognise that he is a very useful plot device for EB so I can forgive him.

As Anita said the series is very varied as regards plots and settings which helps to keep it fresh. It remains one of my favourite EB series'.

[Red Tower]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceQ8smSio3Q

What in god's name is this? It's got characters like Nanny Betts to replace Miss Dimity, kids with different names, Thadeus a sailor, Clovis Monk and Charlotte Clancy. I hadn't come across the tv series before, but this is an absolute abomination.

I think that I managed to listen to about four minutes.