Would you let your children befriend Barney?

[MJE]

I think she may well have been trying to think of a differant animal for the Barney series as opposed to the usual dog that everyone has in her books.

     I find it far more satisfactory when an animal in the books is able to play a *real* role in the plot, and not be merely an amiable hanger-on. Dogs can sniff a trail that humans can't, they can take messages (tied to their collar), and they can even protect people if they are big and strong enough, and suitably trained. Timmy can do all these things; Scamper appears to be little more than the amiable hanger-on I mentioned.
     One of the interesting aspects about a monkey is that, in addition to being able to things like these (can they sniff trails like a dog, too? - I'm not sure), they also have hands - so they can do things that require manual dexterity - which could make them even more useful still. That is one reason I contemplated having a monkey in a story I now want to write (and have begun recently); but the research came up with so many down-sides, that I discarded the idea - with some regret. Also, I didn't want to take even the slightest risk of appearing to copy the Barney stories too closely - even though I would write in my own way, and the monkey's owner was to be a completely different type of person to Barney.

A parrot had already been used

     There are a few credibility problems too, but they strike me as less profound than those with a monkey. Kiki's potential usefulness is different yet again: her ability to mimic human voices, and her ability to fly. I do seem to recall places where Enid Blyton exploited both of these for plot purposes, although I don't recall the details offhand.

... and cats are not that exciting really."

     Well, as a person whose favourite animal is cats (I'm not really an animal lover beyond that), I might dispute that. But where they would be remarkably useless in a story of that type is that they can't really be trained to do anything that would be useful in an adventure plot (that I can think of, at least); and moreover, they don't even have a tendency to follow their owner like a dog or monkey (or parrot?) might - so even just managing them to ensure they didn't get lost would be a major problem - if it could be done, it would just mess up the plot too much.

On the other hand a monkey would have a certain appeal to many children and that is probably why she chose it.

     Undoubtedly true - and I think it was a factor in my early thinking. But I think I let reality limit me far more than Enid Blyton did.

All of Blyton's animal characters are, to a certain extent, a bit too good to be true.

     True.

Regards, Michael.


P.S.:
     I'm off now - I may not be back for some days, or if I am, it may be only briefly. (I explained that elsewhere.)

[pete9012S]

Yes, going one stage further than giving him a ride, would you let your children befriend and go away on holiday with him?

I like to think that like Andy from The Adventurous Four that there was something instantly honest and reassuring about meeting Barney that quickly put people at ease.

I'm sure there are quite a few examples in the books of grown ups taking to Barney and even Miranda quite quickly, even though they realised he obviously lived quite a hard hand to mouth existence?

[Viv of Ginger Pop]

Here's another example for Blyton's detractors that her stories are only about middle class kids.

Barney has had a very poor start to life, but is cheerful, charming, intelligent, diligent and prepared to make friends with younger posh kids.

So to answer the question - even though I don't have kids - in principle, having read Blyton, I'd hope that I'd be open enough to look at the individual on his merits.

Viv

[MJE]

Here's another example for Blyton's detractors that her stories are only about middle class kids.

Barney has had a very poor start to life, but is cheerful, charming, intelligent, diligent and prepared to make friends with younger posh kids.

     Even quite apart from Barney, there are *plenty* of less-than-middle-class kids in Blyton who are portrayed very favourably, even being a central character at times. How many circus stories are there with such kids being portrayed favourably? I think there are several such.
     Then there's Nobby in "Five Go Off in a Caravan" - clearly nothing like middle-class; yet who couldn't help liking him? (I was a bit shocked to see him named "Ned" in the Wikipedia article on that novel - is it some ridiculous updating by censorious do-gooders? Is there something wrong with the name "Nobby"? If so, I can't imagine what it is, and I'm considering editing the article to rename the "Ned"s as "Nobby".)
     There are the two children Pip and Susy-Ann in "Boys' and Girls' Circus Book" (it is a circus novel, despite the odd title which almost suggests non-fiction), and they and their new circus friend Jerry are the central characters in this book. I would say that Pip and Susy-Ann definitely are lower down the social scale than middle-class, considering that their widowed father has moved to Australia, leaving the two to go to Homes for Poor Children, until they run away to the circus. In Blytonland at least, middle-class parents do not just move abroad, heedlessly leaving their own children to whatever fate might befall them.
     Perhaps Sniffer in "Five Go to Mystery Moor" is even further down the scale socially than some of these, being a dirty gypsy boy with habits many would find repellent and unhygienic - yet the book somehow manages to make him seem attractive, and he seems to be a loyal and decent boy for all the upbringing he probably had. The Five try to teach him better ways without belittling or humiliating him - and he seems to take heed.
     So I think you can find plenty of examples of Enid Blyton championing lower-class children. I never saw her as classist in any way. It is true that she often writes stories featuring children who have maids and gardners and such, which may even suggest the upper class more than the middle class; but I think only the very "woke", excessively politically correct would see it as classist merely to depict such characters.

Regards, Michael.

[Boodi 2]

My feeling is that parents today do not have much influence over who their children become friendly with, especially in the case of teenagers. Thankfully I never had any major problems in that regard and on the two or three occasions when my son befriended a child who I (rightly or wrongly) considered "unsuitable" I found that a "softly-softly" approach was best, where I did not actively discourage him from meeting the child in question, but made it clear that I was not impressed. In two cases he quickly tired of the new "friend", while in the third case I was wrong and despite coming from an extremely dysfunctional family the child was absolutely fine (almost like Barney)!!!

[Debbie]

Barney though turns out to be half middle class, so then becomes suitable.

It's a bit like the old school stories. When you had the new scholarship girl, who is looked down on snobbily by the nasty girl. Inevitably they turn out to have money/family/both, normally greater than snobby girl (who often loses hers at the same time). It shows a sort of inbuilt snobbery that if they are so academic/sporty/beloved by everyone with perfect manners that they have to "really" be of the right class.

However I don't think EB does that with several of her characters, Nobby, Sniffer, Jo, Jimmy, Lotta all of whom don't change. So I absolve her of that!

With the children, especially once they get to Roger's age, banning a friendship is rather likely to make the person more attractive, so potentially counterproductive.

[Hannah]

Would it have been easier in Enids day for friendships like this to exist-to the point of allowing your children to go away on holiday with someone like Barney.

I'm not sure how I'd react though I'd hope not to be too prejudiced.

In the first four books the children never go on holidays "with Barney" though. They are always on their own first and Barney then shows up. It's only in the last two books after he's found his father that they really go to meet Barney with their parents knowledge.

[MJE]

In the first four books the children never go on holidays "with Barney" though. They are always on their own first and Barney then shows up. It's only in the last two books after he's found his father that they really go to meet Barney with their parents knowledge.

     But Mr. and Mrs. Lynton have certainly met Barney by then, and I recall they liked him.
     In fact, who couldn't help but like him? - he presents such a good impression, is polite and respectful, and exudes a sense of responsibility and dependability, so that if you needed help in a crisis, he was someone you could rely on.
     Didn't Mr. Lynton say in one of the books something along the lines of "Any friend of Roger's is a friend of mine"? - high praise indeed, coming from him.
     Barney is one of my favourite Blyton characters.

Regards, Michael.

[pete9012S]

Yes, I agree Michael.
Barney and also Andy from the Adventurous Four books posses most likeable, hardworking and trustworthy personalities that I really admire.

[IceMaiden]

Interesting question. Not easy to answer either and I don't have children but I'll try.

The Barney that is in Enid's books is immensely likeable, honest, trustworthy and reliable. Despite being basically a tramp be doesn't come across as one. I never once in all my readings and rereadings of the stories saw Barney as what you would normally think of a tramp - a dirty, smelly, unclean, unwashed, unpleasant rank looking man in rags. I felt quite sure he looked nothing like this or people wouldn't let him into their houses, in Ring o' Bells several villagers were quite wiling to let him stay, they wouldn't do so if he looked and smelled like he'd crawled out of a cesspit! He is written as a nice, friendly good looking, tidy boy and that is my mental image of him. I like EB's character of 'Barney' very much.

If Barney was a real person however it would be a different story. A real person living like Barney does would not be clean, tidy, fresh smelling and good looking. They would almost certainly be full of coughs and sneezes from roughing it in all weathers. Bad digestive system from not eating properly with no toilet paper on hand. Heaven knows what lice, ticks, mites and fleas would be on them from lying in haystacks, under hedges, wearing filthy old clothes and carrying a monkey about constantly. In short they wouldn't be a very healthy or wise choice to be around. Enid Blyton doesn't mention these because well the reality isn't half as nice and exciting sounding as the picture she paints is it? Much like Kiki and Mischief, Barney is someone you'd be happy to see anywhere in the pages of a book but in real life wouldn't work. In the same way that the Wishing Chair sounds marvellous on paper but I wouldn't really want to be sat on a chair higher up than the clouds with nothing to hold on to! Nor would I want to climb a tree that reached up to the sky or climb down a well. But Enid makes these things seem so enticing, dangerous and exciting (with none of the downsides such as dying) which of course in a story they are and Barney is one of those.

So would I let my children befriend Barney? Enid Blyton's Barney, yes I would. Real life Barney - no chance.

[MJE]

     Well... that certainly does prick the bubble of my illusion about Barney - yet somehow rings true.
     And yet... Barney might be able to take at least some steps to keep himself, if not clean, then at least not too rank: buy used (clean) cIothes from charity shops in towns or villages, always keep toilet paper handy, and maybe wash clothes in streams as he encountered them. (Did coin laundries exist in those days? I have a feeling not.)
     And he would probably make an extra effort to make himself clean before visiting people who were not circus or fair folk.
     Well, I'm trying to cling to at least some idea that he could remain somewhat respectable.... I think the monkey might actually be the biggest problem.

Regards, Michael.

[Moonraker]

     Well... that certainly does prick the bubble of my illusion about Barney

And mine! I'm so pleased I didn't analyse the character in such detail as a child-reader!

[Anita Bensoussane]

Interesting discussion. I'm not sure what proportion of his life Barney spends sleeping rough as opposed to working at fairs, circuses, etc. When he's in work he presumably has access to a bed or bunk, clean water and a stove to cook on. Even when he's tramping around, we know he sometimes finds an old hall to sleep in and he will no doubt have put money by to be able to feed himself during those periods. Even a diet of cold food would be nutritious enough if it consisted of all the basics - bread, cold meat and fish, cheese, fresh fruit, raw tomatoes, raw carrots, nuts, dried fruit, tinned fruit, tinned milk, etc. Tinned soup and tinned beans could also be eaten cold if there was no way of heating them up. Of course, food would quickly go off in the summer months so Barney would only be able to buy small quantities of fresh food at a time - not that he would want to carry too much around with him anyway.

[Bertie]

I'm not a parent but, as Anita says, an interesting discussion.
I've never really considered too much about whether Barney was a believable portrayal. Which is a surprise really, as even as a very young child I was, apparently, always wondering about things like 'But where did they wash? Use the toilets? Put the toilet paper? Where do the dogs and other animals poo when they're on Islands, in caves, shut up in sheds and bedrooms?' etc. And I always pick up on how some circus folk switch between speaking 'common', and saying they'd never spent a day at school, to suddenly speaking just like the Famous Five or Find-Outers. For instance, the lad at the Waxworks Hall in Missing Necklace.
And, yet, I always bought into Barney. As Anita pointed out, he does spend some time working and getting a (small) wage and giving him access to bed, water, better meals, etc. And Enid covers the point that his wage allows him to, just about, get food and some kind of longings for some of the other time when he's between jobs. Even so, it's established that you have to look past the dirty and patched up clothes, that he's tried his very best to keep as clean and mended as possible, in order to judge him as a person, not on his current social standing. And, on doing that, you see he's a perfectly fine young person doing his very best to grow up well under very difficult circumstances. In real life, I suppose It's highly unlikely someone would grow up like Barney under the same circumstances. But that's the beauty of the fictional world, and I think Enid successfully achieves making the highly unlikely at least believable in Barney's case.

[Moonraker]

But where did they use the toilets? Put the toilet paper?

Surely, Bertie, you must know that Blyton characters neither use nor need toilets.